2019, January 23rd at 10 AM PT/ 7 PM CET

How individuals and collectives can evolve together


How do evolve to the challenges we collectively face and to realize the potentially we sense? The collectives and relationships we are in limit us and can liberate us. Likewise, as individuals we shape and give form to our collectives. How can a new view of what it means to be ‘I’ and ‘We’ give liberate us to evolve individually and collectively? Drawing on the discoveries of the last 12 years of Pacific Integral’s intensive development programs, Geoff Fitch will discuss the perspectives and practices that have emerged through their work.

Our conversation will touch on topics like: how our view of I and We evolves as we wake up and develop our consciousness; how individual and collective shadow can be worked with; how individuals and collectives go through disorienting transformations as they evolve; and the importance of intimacy, embodiment and play.

Geoff F

STREAMED LIVE HERE on January 23rd 2019

0:00 Intro by Heidi in Italy

0:53 Martin Ucik introduces himself from Turkey

1:38 Geoff Fitch from Pacific Integral, leads  integral informed development program since 2014, stating the 30th this year.

3:12 Heidi: How did you come into INTEGRAl? Geoff answers

3:48 Integral is an evolutionary stage, natural development. Lifelong exploration. When he was ready he understood Ken WIlber’s books “The marriage of sense and soul” grabbed him.

5:50 Heidi: That’s what we thought to know, and Wilber gives words to it.

6:30 Geoff starts with the topic “How individuals and collectives can evolve together”, the WHY? Refers to Brother Steindl Ross. Care for the Whole, our common humanity and the big questions right now.

8:45 Origin of his work: supporting leaders, change agents. Ethical orientation.

9:50 Heidi: development of individuals to collectives?

Geoff answers: The work is structured as a longer term developmental process, working with collectives. See the interplay of individuals and collectives.

12:00 Focus on research based on developmental model, integral Spiral Dynamics, ultimately Stages model by Terry O’Fallon. 3 tiers, concrete, subtle metaware, evolution of the WE.

14:20 Ethnocentric stage: first understanding of living in a collective. Concrete collective, visible We. In Orange, still in concrete we, but in a more subtle mind. In green the subtle, hidden, We begins to take shape. Arising of the WE-space. Not dependent on the particular collective.

16:55 Heidi: felt recognition of We-space

17:20 G: the hidden subtle context. Green and beyond. Quality of the We-space. A new “I” gets formed.

19:20 Martin asks about the “right hand quadrants”.

G: more the dance between upper and lower quadrants. Exterior manifestation of interior experience.

21:00 Martin talks about the difficulties in the right quadrants like in relationships: money and sex

22:05 Geoff:  Money and sex come from an earlier stage. “Sex and stuff”. Shadow elements of earlier stages not well integrated

23:45 What is healthy development. Integral stuff provides also ways to bypass!.

25:00 Including the shadows, being inclusive of what we have missed. Transcending is easier than including.. It is a life-long work. Space of experience vs. space of being in the world. “The measure of our realisation is our conduct”

27:15 Heidi: We-spaces different for people in relationships and among strangers. How can we create it in family relationships

28:30 Geoff first finishes his explanations. We evolve through the territories as a sequence of self and we. The markers of evolution. We-space is equivalent to the subtle WE in his work.

30:50 How do we bring that in our relationships? State experience, Heidi: the feeling of being in the same space and of interruption

32:20 Deep feeling of connection is the ultimate ideal, subtle deep resonance with each other. Unhealthy manifestation is the avoidance of the difficult stuff. Diane Hamilton; UNity and diversity. Unity at expense of diversity then it is not fully integrated. No development is good when it comes at the expense of something important.

34:40 In the openness and depth of the we-space that work can be done. Be honest with yourself and be aware of idealism

35:4ß Heidi refers to Martin’s work. Willingness to be and contribute to that we-space. One person can disrupt it. Example. A we-space created in internet conversations. When we are on levels too different than it can be problematic.

37:35 Martin: even if one person can hold the space for the other, it is difficult. Frustration of being more “advanced” than the other.

39:20 Geoff: there is a potential for a deeper resonance across the developmental levels, across our ability to connect through language. Internet is a good example for disruption. Any kind of We-space has a certain form of context in the subtle level. Certain norms and practices. Not necessarily conscious.

42:30 G: How does the collective integrate this? Help collectives to become self-aware? Understand the subtle spaces, meta-conversation, what needs to be integrated? Collective evolution.

Collective shadow? =A taste of his work!

45:35 How Geoff’s groups work: in person and online integrated.

46:20 Martin: How is your stages model different than the others? Geoff answers: out of Lovenger and developed. Integrated the quadrants.

48:10 His model is also predictive, looking at the deeper structure. Research on the quadrants. “ later stages over those of Susan Cook Greuter, co-evolved with Terry O’Fallons work.

49:50 Martin: How many people are in the higher stages? Geoff laughs. Heidi includes that we are varying through the stages in everyday life.

51:00 We don’t know how many and what the significance of the numbers is. How are we doing in our collective development? Earlier stages are present in individuals and also in collectives. The difference between the cultural sphere (in US) in green and political sphere in orange. In cultural sphere some integral perspective possible. Millenial generation: very practical perspectives, but LR quadrants work against that.

54:30 Internet as a green open democratic space has been largely disrupted. Now we cannot create the context for our conversation.

56:00 Diversity of development all over the world: MArtin says: not quite in Turkey! G: there is the capacity for stage development, but we are not necessarily socially at the same level, but individually there is the capacity available.

57:00 Martin: At which level are you? Difficult to answer. Heidi: Why do we need a label?

59:10 Heidi starts to wrap up: How do we come together instead of fighting.

1:00:00 Reach Geoff:, program: Generating tranformative change (USA, Australia. New Zealand). Final words of everyone.


Ken wilber wrote his first book “The spectrum of Consciousness” in 1977. It took a long while until people got aware of this author and his philosophy, today called INTEGRAL THEORY,. Still today, unfortunately, many people whose work could hugely benefit from that knowledge don’t know about it yet.

I personally read my first Wilber book in 1997 and I had an epiphany. My understanding of the world changed rapidly, I was excited by what I learned and I was looking for people who knew about this worldview and were trying to embody it. I found the INTEGRALES FORUM in Germany in 2000 and from then on I went to their meetings and conferences every year. It was essential for me to meet people who would understand me and what my ideas were – while in my surrounding, friends and family, I found no resonance at all.

Since those days in many places of the world integral hubs, institutes and forums have come into existence where people can come together to explore this integral view of the world,, to be together in a completely different way than we were used to before without any need to give long explanations to people who were not ready to listen, as it normally happened when outside of these circles.

One of these hubs is PACIFIC INTEGRAL. In this show we talk with its founder Geoff Fitch. We have the  opportunity to explore the work they have been doing at Pacific Integral and the lessons’s they have learned through the Generating Transformative Change program.


Geoff Fitch is a coach, trainer, and facilitator of growth in individuals and organizations, and a creator of international transformative learning programs.

He is a founder of Pacific Integral, where was instrumental in the development of the acclaimed Generating Transformative Change program, which has been delivered on three continents and in its 29th cohort. Through these programs, he has researched and developed novel approaches to individual and collective growth, and has designed and facilitated dozens of residential learning retreats.

He has been exploring diverse approaches to cultivating higher human potentials for over 25 years, including somatic and transpersonal psychology, mindfulness, innovation and creativity, leadership, integral theory, and collective intelligence.

Geoff also has over 30 years experience in leadership in business. He holds a master’s degree in Transpersonal Psychology from the Institute of Transpersonal Psychology and B.S. in Computer Science, magna cum laude, from Boston University, and has additional studies jazz music, philosophy, and management.