Transcript: We meet again the women matters and it's April the end of April already 2024 and we are in five and again three continents and one two three four countries so in five people it's quite International shall we go to the most in the South that means Hannelieto do the check in yeah Deep South down under yes I'm good um but really had amazing weekend we had a salon on a creative leadership salon on Saturday night and it was really great because we had 11 voices speaking truth about not so it was not a discussion but speaking truth about our power to create versus abuse of power so we had the voice of children of nature of artificial intelligence of spont of synchronicity of humor of the Future Organization the future of work sacred feminine possibility um playfulness yeah we had 11 voices like that so it was really great and then last night we had a reconnecting to our creative agency workshop and this morning I was listening to session from Chris Patricia Alber about exploring the radical potential Beyond personal transformation and that was also just amazing so here I am Sun Sun is setting here on the side so you'll see the light on my face beautiful view because I'm upstairs today and I'm passing to Christine okay good morning uh um not a whole lot to report the weeks go by quickly I don't know what happens it's just uh things move quickly um I think Lorraine I just texted Lorraine she said um she's got a patient this morning and uh I know she's been busy uh taking care of her friend who had some surgery she went up to Los Angeles to stay with her for a while and um I think since we last talked my husband's brother passed away so that was yeah that was two weeks ago tomorrow and um so uh Tom's been planning his funeral uh so we're going to have a go back e for a memorial in early June um he's going to be he was cremated and he's his remains are going to be buried and then we'll go back and do a celebration of life in early June and so I mean death has been more on my mind just the mortality of us all um his brother kind of died alone or at least nobody was there um at the time that he passed um so uh yeah kind of sad for Tom he had six siblings he had three older siblings three younger siblings and uh now he only has one sister left so anyway but that's not me that's him uh but I've been uh busy trying to be supportive of that and again not much else to say so I will pass on to Victoria thank you I'm sorry um to hear about your brother-in-law and please convey my condolences um yeah death has been on my mind a lot too lately not because I've lost anybody um recently but it the issues still unresolved issues with my mother's estate um have once again reared their ugli head ugly heads um so I've been in a very dark place having to it's it's actually more about the the living than the dead I should shouldn't laugh but it's all too horrible um that's my vion spirit coming out my AK Libra Austine um I have to laugh because it's all so horrible I mean it's beyond horrible my my sister I mean I won't go into the details because they're too gruesome and too tedious but the upshot is that my we're we're five years into this my my mother died five almost five and a half years ago it should have all been resolved in six months easily with no it's not like it's a giant multi-million dollar estate um and we're allegedly in the last lap of the journey and my sister is trying to claim all of my all of the things that belong to me since childhood which she knows perfectly well that they're mine and things I was given by my parents like I've I have a collection of of beatric Potter figurines anyway I won't go into the details but um it's just s such a low blow it's shocking to me that it's it's a kind of lack of um moral fiber not let alone just courtesy and and kindness um it it's just so appalling so I'm just trying I'm trying to remind myself um more about death because because it's all everything's passing away anyway I'm in a Budd this class right now that's doing the five remembrances which are um about old age sickness death losing everything and everyone we love and then the last one of the five remembrances is all we have is our Karma all we have is is our our own actions in this world which makes me think of honol with this idea of creative potential and and um creativity and the positive um so that's kind of why I've been focused on death lately it's because I'm trying to get perspective that that no matter what happens in this life it's impermanent anyways there there are bigger bigger issues on our planet than whether I get my Beatrix Potter figurines so that's where I am and I will pass of course um since Heidi eyes gets the last word to monia in Vienna good to see you again mon great things well um I had a very cultural weekend first time in years that I went to an exhibition in schlo luxenburg the luxenburg palace 30 minutes from Vienna beautiful place with my son-in-law and we friends of ours have their exhibition of their Gallery there which was kind of yeah unusual and I wasn't tired that's what made me very happy and yesterday I was at the Opera at the Martine by the new director um uh for lohen Green Oh Premiere again and they have a different aspects and uh I'm not a great friend of Wagner but uh some of his uh works are quite yeah amazing and we had at the same time in Vienna there was a marathon and in front of the Opera they had loud speakers and drum Ramba Samba and it was such a parallel world when we all came out from the Opera and it was just amazing how people live their lives anyway um I'm still upset about uh my computer and how this doesn't work and it's probably uh Firefox and Google fighting against each other on my very old computer so maybe I will have to really consider getting a new one um yeah on the other hand uh I very much faced with that everything is just impermanent I I had I didn't have any siblings so I was an only child and it's amazing because I had a similar story like uh Victoria told us of somebody in who lives in for alberg that's in the West and his mother called and uh asked him for assistance because daughter uh just she assumes that uh she will pay for what the house costs and uh because her stepfather had done this up to now and now he passed away eight months ago and she still expects everybody else to chip in but she is earning quite a lot she is the best earning member of that family and uh this uh man is an integral trained integrally trained person so he has the vocabulary but they don't understand him so they just their conversation he says their conversation uh exists of trigger words trying to trigger each other emotionally so uh until nobody uh really is calm anymore and he has been trying but he is just like uh he's not at home there anymore he has been away so long and he changed and so I don't know I think it's really the worst time of the life when you when when your parents pass away and then all this fighting starts and I'm very happy that we didn't neither my husband nor I did have this to face to face this it's it's the greed and and uh I don't know the the disrespect is just amazing and um this uh mother is also e 7even or 89 and she was trying to get her uh by a doctor that she's demanded but she isn't at all so it's just so as what Victoria said about the moral fi of people uh sometimes it's amazing and when a a parent passes it's just like uh you become very childlike again so it's really as we say Kish the way they act anyway I'm glad I don't have to face that but of course my husband isn't getting any better and it breaks my heart to watch him how he copes and what he can't cope anymore so that's also a rather sad ter for us yeah that's about what I have to participate ID I'm passing on to you yeah thank you you didn't do the weather forecast or the weather uh service you normally start with saying how the weather is I can tell you how it is here it's gray and unusually cold cool uh when the sun is out it's hot you take everything up and when the clouds are there um cold so and I have fire in the in the stove because I I had already put all the wood away because I thought it's summer now no it's not so that was the weather uh report otherwise yeah I find that this are strange times now in this uh it's accelerating in many ways many topics come up and come near and then they dissolve again in my life at least and um talking about death I think it's quite a good idea and about what it can teach us and about uh we have to let go because in these times where we don't know where we will end up um better to let go before than than later yeah and then uh to the question of fight between the siblings and losing siblings we were five we are five we are still all alive and when my mother finally passed away about oh it's already 15 years ago uh there was no fight whatsoever it was really great despite we don't have a great big connection but it was just normal it was a good time being all together again because my sister is in America no and I'm in Italy so it's hardly that we meet all together but at her death we were together and it was quiet and nice and finally a sort of connection which I felt which I hadn't felt before from maybe never I don't know so for me it would be okay if we talked about this topic loss letting go and quarreling about something I mean that's in the little uh area and in the big area no America against Russia is qu about power and whatever and we in the siblings are quaring about pieces or things in in the house is it does it belong to humans that we really have to to to to to to demonstrate our power by getting stuff from others which maybe not is not ours and you know fighting for things that would be my suggestion for today but I'm open to others yeah I I I she sharing that I'm taken back to when I was much younger my mother's my grandmother's brother um never married and he lived with my grandparents on their farm so when he passed he was always fond of the girls so all my my cousins H he was fond of us the the girl cousins not the boy cousins so he left his few belongings to us girls so they were like four of us and we were much younger at the time and my aunt my cousin's mother she organized that they took everything and they she he had beautiful things really really valuable things but my S neither my sister or I was really into such things so we didn't really mind but my mother was really distraught at the time um that they just took everything because some of it was really valuable but I think it taught me a very a big lesson when I was still very young of the value of such things so we just let it go we just said we didn't want it and and I'm grateful for that lesson and even when my mom passed we we were like you Heidi my siblings and I we didn't fight over anything it was really although we're also not that close it was all stay different cities and things like that we we gladly didn't fight over anything that she left behind but she was very clever long before her death she would and she had valuable furniture in Boya furniture and long before she died she already gave it away so there was not much left to then distribute between us anyway but even at that time when she was wanted to give something to us we would say no rather give it to somebody else you know it's it's okay because we didn't have the space for it because it was quite big big furniture so that helped a lot as well I think in the Pro but she was really Forward Thinking at the time of she didn't want people fighting over her stuff so for me it is then strange when people do fight about things like that you know but I do understand also when people treasure something because of some memories so there's that side too but for myself personally I'm grateful for that experience with my my mother's my grandmother's brother because it did instill another sense of what we value in life I missed him terribly because he was such an amazing man sitting on his lap as a little girl that's the memories that I took birth me and just being with him on the farm and walking into the mountains together with him and things like that and him carrying me on his back because I got tired and things those memories are really still alive in my body and in my mind beautiful so Furniture is reminding me my mother left the furniture which she retained valuable to my sister but my sister is in California and we my mother in Germany so my sister said how can I take this and I I really cannot transport it and I don't want it so it was open and then one of the nephews the daughter of my brother said oh she would like to have it and okay have it you know it was really easy this thing and nobody thought no I want to have it maybe sell it maybe it gets money no nobody thought about that that was really good reminds me to think about to give away stuff and I would like to find people who would like to have the stuff which I want to get rid of like a lot of musical uh books you know not notes um written music of Italian opera and German songs and things like that I would like to find somebody who who wants to have it instead of throwing it away thank you for reminding me of that because that I know the young opera singer in South Africa I'm still connect you too she really was very positive about connecting with you about that you know in case I should come I I don't think so to the African conference I can fill my my suitcase with these things do you have a I'm sorry I'm hijacking a little bit conversation have you noticed about the conference is it is it uh taking place yeah they have they've just said we must save the date they haven't given any information yet okay and the other conference in America will be next month isn't it Christine yeah it it starts on May 16th uh a Thursday Friday Satur half day Thursday Friday Saturday half day Sunday yeah and it's happening there's about 120 or 30 people in person and about another 25 or so online all over the world from Japan to wherever lots of different place somebody coming from South Africa uh ra do you know ra yeah yeah so yeah it'll be nice I would like to participate online but I know when I was together with Mark uh waking up at 3:00 and then listening was different I myself I don't think I can motivate myself to to get up exactly yeah I'm wondering uh Christine will you be able to give us a short summary afterwards after the conference if there was anything unexpected anything knew anything uh that just promotes integral to a new stage maybe because this is what we are uh yeah we are wondering about and we are trying to find authors in Vienna we trying to find authors who will just continue wilas because wi sort of is stopped he he doesn't and I had a dream a couple of days ago uh about my spirituality in the four quadrants and uh I saw a very clear sketch of of and that the quadrants and it was threedimensional that the quadrants uh shouldn't be straight lines but just you can SE through the quadrants because whenever you enter a new stage uh and the quadrant they sort of mingle it's not just dualistic inside outside and well I haven't seen it and and I was sort of gliding down from uper here uh and was introducing myself and I was talking about it uh so and what I found very interesting was that the lower left quadrant has expanded for me because when we started out with the Ken wil working arbert CH Ken wilver there were hardly any people at the lower left when we once we put the quadrants there and nobody was just everybody was uper on the upper right because that was easy you could measure anything and everything and in the lower in the lower left uh were just was just I and somebody else and now I I know that in the lower left I have frown failed I have the women and I have peer groups and we still have a zoom Salon in Vienna so this really has expanded and on the lower right uh was the web and YouTube and all these meditations online that has expanded enormously as as well so there is a change but nobody ever talks about it to will they talk about it at the conference Christine what do you think the theme is the future human so people are supposed to be projecting you know where they think we're headed so I'd be happy to give uh a summary of you know maybe new ideas or where it would be great yeah people seem to be yeah I mean there certainly is a concern like who's going to pick up you know where Ken left off although that's not possible but um certainly there's not going to be another Ken Wilbur but uh yeah people are concerned about making sure that it doesn't just yeah drift away or just yeah beny county is very good so uh I'm wondering if he has any new ideas uh that would be interesting yeah anyway that fits also into the topic because Ken is about to to leave let's say no he is not anymore in his productive face and uh he has guided the the movement let's say not the movement but the he gave the inspiration and the the the the content of the movement what you are talking about I try to translate it a little bit for people who might not know what it is when you talk about the lower left that means the we the the the culture together and the upper right where normally you start when you dive into integral this the theory to think about this and and so we met by this and then you created the the women's um field Consciousness field in person then and then we started to to go into the lower left uh into the we real let's say no so yeah and I think can W in a different way has the same problem as I who do whom do I leave my stuff so and he has passed many moments where he might have been dead so I think death is also a a topic also for him also for us as we started with the topic death and Legacy yeah I think Legacy is even more important than than um well I not more important than death sorry I'm still still getting my wits together here um but I think th that was very poignant when you mentioned Heidi the the I'm so glad there's someone that wants all your music books um I um because in in one phase of the of the my mother's estate so far um which it's a is a long convoluted story but the upshot is my my favorite cousin lived on one of the properties for many years and then left very abruptly he he became a very violent difficult alcoholic and um my mother had to send him back to his mother her sister because she my mother felt like wasn't her responsibility anyway he died from alcoholism just around Christmas um and so everything that he owned was left on my mother's property um anyway it's a long complicated story but the uh I only could go one day it was emotionally too hard for me beatric was a real Champion she went day after day after day and sorted through um there had been squatters living there and there had been a rat Invasion and there had been Breakin it was a nightmare it was really like going through hell and beatric was really Brave I I don't know what it was in her except I wish she were here to talk about it but um she felt she felt compelled to go through this whole all this chaos and save the things that were of importance um not in terms of material value but because she's an artist and she's thinking along creative lines um but so she of course my my cousin who was a brilliant pianist left a lot of M there was a lot of music there and um I'm not even sure where it is right now I think it's being stored somewhere I think we just because I couldn't handle it just I think it all went into storage but it's that question of what um how you know I have a i' a my my best friend who's a concert pianist has this immense he lives in New York City and as you know space is at a premium there he has he has a collection of literally of thousands upon thousands of vintage vinyl classical music recordings things that are and now there's kind of a Renaissance of people wanting to have vinyl again um it's kind of a fad but most of the people who are in that fad group want um like the original Beatles record you know it's a different it's not classical music um it's not vilhelm Kemp playing P snaz or whatever but my friend has this crisis because he doesn't know what now he's burdened down by these material possessions and um so he keeps trying to sell them one by one on the internet and then if he he's only so far selling the ones where he has a duplicate I mean it's it's very crazy and I keep saying to him just let it go just sit down at the piano and play yourself because you're a brilliant pianist you know give bring joy to your own body and soul by immersing yourself in in realtime music don't spend you know because he'll spend hundreds of hours you know advertising these recordings that he wants to S and then he has a collection of thousands of ties silk men's ties and he goes to the he has a Seasons subscription at the Metropolitan Opera he's kind of like an Oscar wild type and he I went he took me to a concert there for my birthday in September when I was in New York it was a recital at the Met And he as we walked into the to the theater he said um he said look around Victoria he said he said I'm the only one here besides the ushers he said who was wearing a tie you know the ushers still dress and it's beautiful they wear these silk capes these big black capes I don't know if any of you have been to the Metropolitan oper but they have this long-standing you know hundreds year old tradition of the ushers are so beautifully dressed and and in the 1860s or whatever they the users just look like everybody else but now they look like they're part of the production because they're so beautiful and so impeccably dressed and they're very formal and very you know that that tradition has stayed absolutely the same for like 150 years or whatever and it and and I agree with my friend except that I I don't want to spend my emotional and spiritual energy on on deploring the fact that the old traditions and the old values are going out the way it's it like and what what you said monia about coming out of the Opera and there was all the loudspeakers and all this chaos and this this whatever it was the protest or whatever it was it's exactly that's I mean when I'm not feeling well emotionally I can't even go out like yesterday I was feeling really poorly and um I was trying to figure out where can I go to like get out and see some nature but not be bombarded with hundreds of people and loudspeakers and noise and everyone celebrating Earth day today is Earth Day oh that could have been our theme um you just mentioned you triggered you us the trigger word um and I was wondering if we could delve into that you mentioned spiritual energy my spiritual energy is it my emotional okay emotional energy uh I know my spirit ual so what is spiritual energy is that you really you or is that something that is comes alive in you but isn't you that's a question oh no no no it's we all we all have it and we all feel it and we all whether we acknowledge it as such or not I'm convinced of that um I think it's very real I mean that's also why am I surprised in people that don't believe in God because um however people want to define the spiritual or the Divine to me it's so palpable and I see people around me who are affected by it whether they whether they acknowledge it consciously or not I think it's a real thing it's it's um I mean it's it's kind of you know I mean I I don't I don't know you um maybe Christine has take over here or whoever our yungan specialist is on the call um because I I don't I have to confess I've read it only tiny fragments of Yung um and mostly just heard people toss his name around and I don't know if they're making it up or not but but that idea of the collective Consciousness the idea that or the collective unconscious or whatever this sense that there's there's actually something in every space I think that's why like with protests and um and rallies and all that kind of thing you can feel to me that isn't there's a spiritual energy it's not it's not necessarily the emotional energy it's it's something that's that's um deeper or higher well on know huny you would be someone to talk about this too because isn't that what you're tapping into all the time with your workshops and your creative work that I mean this kind of create we all have whatever it is whatever you want to call it I mean for me it's the spiritual energy but that's the word I would use I didn't even know I said it monia you were listening listening more carefully than I what is she talking about I feel it what is it I didn't even I didn't even hear it but um so anyway I'll just I'll pass it out to everybody else to to say what they but I think it's a very real thing and it's we're all we're all part of it or or immersed in it or whatever how do you notice it that's now is the spiritual energy active in me let let H say her five cents because Hallelujah now you put me on the spot for me it's a level of awareness of something we feel deeply like you say Victoria it's within without it's everywhere it's hard to explain it in because it's it's very experiential it's not a concept as such it's something that you deeply experience and on a personal level for me it's My Breath of Life my my life force but it's life force and everything else too it's not separate it's yeah it's a deeply felt sense of the seen and the Unseen yeah and for me the for me the easiest way to to share it in a workshop is to is to guide people to connect with their breath and and through movement as well movement is easy to easier to connect to it than sitting still it's just my own experience but people can also connect with it through meditation for other practices so it's very hard to explain it it's not I think when we try to explain we go into our LIF brains question H is it also that what sort of as we were starting with death is it that what what remains when we are dying I mean but is not dying that's the spirit of the place as well zist it's the spirit of everything it's it's our Essence that speak as well it's like if you if you are spiritually in the word the way we use the the vocabul the word if you are spiritually in poverty there's no you know there's no life it's like you're Deb your dead even when you're you're living I don't know how else to explain it it's that yeah and and can be very different for different people I don't think there's one recipe for it either we all are unique in expressing in expressing that that energy but it's behind everything Christine what is your take on that well um yeah I was thinking as hon said I was thinking of it in terms of air and you can pay attention to your breath but you don't need to it's it's always going to work on its own you don't have to give it some conscious thought but you can and it's helpful to think about it but I guess the energy part I mean there's Spirit but Mona said spiritual energy specifically so the energy part to me feels like um has to do with connection so whether an individual is connecting with the nonu or the unity of things or whether there's spiritual energy between people um or between a single person and the Divine but there's it to me it speaks to a sense of connectedness it doesn't really exist in a vacuum I think um I think music is a really I I wonder if you agree with me um music is is is a manifestation of spiritual energy and and spiritual energy doesn't necessarily mean um I mean it can be bad and good I I feel that when there's a very um I'm thinking back to I I don't know what that protest was in Vienna but I remember lots of um Pro protest when when we were still living in Vienna um when the government was was becoming increasingly fascist um and I think there this there can be there can be a um a very the spiritual energy can be manifested as a very negative a very destructive force it's not necessarily all you know it's not like Angels you know singing all the time but the but I think in m so even in music the to me the big um there's a there's a palpable difference between uh classical music or not just classical but but whatever life affirming music I'll call it and um and sometimes like when we're driving and and there's a huge like like there's a huge truck next to us and we're waiting at a traffic light and the the music is so loud that even with all of our windows closed it's making my my gut churn literally like the vibrations are so intense that I I start feeling um almost possessed like it's it's and I'm not making the criticism of of what people listen to but rather that that there's there's a it's not a coincidence like just the other day we were down at the warf and my friend was saying because someone rode a bicycle past we were just walking along the the the bay um the harbor and beautiful sunny day and suddenly this bicycle um was speeding past us with the these the music was so loud it I jumped out of my skin and it was that very very um it was like a rap song and it was all F the f bomb as my friend calls it all explo lives and this kind of violent pushing and the voice was pushing it was that and and then I thought back to the boom boxes in New York and the Subways which now are illegal um but still people have them and my friend was saying because he's from New York he said he said that he said listen to that he said that's the spirit of the people who are so depressed and downtrodden who have have not had their they can't their voices cannot be heard it's like the black lives matter thing after you know centuries literally of not being hurt it's that's what emergences is kind of almost um so so it's it's definitely spiritual energy you know that it's coursing through this kind of like if you're not going to you know it's this violence it's it's it's the energy of a but it's it's spirit I call it spiritual because it's not it has a physical manifestation but it's it's like the whole all the rage and we see it so more and more unfortunately right now in our society that's it's um it's all the rage the pent up rage and not being heard and not being seen and not being recognized and not being appreciated and and so so I think it's come out of our culture with the the people who have kind of you know been downtrodden you know oh good yeah I've spoken enough go ahead music can be used for many many many things you know there is music therapy you can use it for good you can use it for incentivized soldiers to go into the in the the last battle and everything so music is has an tremendous power because it goes directly into your emotional and spiritual system and doesn't you don't to have any translation by words and so on and that's also the danger because it can be abused you know well I propose lonia brought up Vagner and that's that's a perfect example where Vagner can be the most Celestial glorious fabulous Transcendent music and it and but Hitler also used it and Hitler was able to that that was how he warmed up his audience in nerur was by blasting Vagner over the loudspeakers and and the people were just they were ready for him when he came to speak um because the music is so vogner's music is I I feel like I mean that's then a whole other conversation like to me there there are different levels of within music of like the music that speaks to the gut and the music that speaks to the heart and then the music that speaks to the like the disembodied Spirit which is like yeah we should have a a interview we should have a conversation between us two about the power of music do you agree that we will do that find an hour and we will do that no I'm happy do but are you are you going to keep it for poster no no no are you GNA keep it for posterity or I mean do I have to be articulate but you are articulate you good in talking so you will find the right words otherwise you take the violin and you know and playing [Laughter] piano okay so music is you know many people say I'm still trying to connect it back to the first um when we talked about thinking of death um in the near-death experiences people have heard music the angels sing or the chesto um harmonic something so is music also then an attempt to console Us in this case or in the another case to incentivize the emotions push up the emotions I mean vogner is also quite you know like the the emotional part it's not it's not Moet let's say Moet has a different way of um emotionality so I I I would ask the the psychologist in this case to explain a little bit yeah you're muted I don't have anything to say sorry nothing to add yeah but also not music about the the what we were talking about the presence of death and the the times now which we are living in and then integral and uh how can we find a a connection between all the topics we have today actually Christine if you could talk about the back to the quadrant thing which um I I confess I'm the least informed in this group by far um but it intrigued me this idea of about Mona's dream and and if I understood correctly when you explained it Heidi the the the the difference between the upper and the lower the the what what's in the mind what's in the head the theory and then what's embodied unless I totally missed your explanation in which case I'll be quiet but but Christine maybe you could talk about the um the the because you were talking about the breath when we were talking about energy and if the breath and the body are the um well in h Le was talking about that too in the the how the bo it's um the the body is where where we actually experience this energy so how does that relate to to this quadrant question like like moving from the so if we're talking about spiritual energy how how is it manifesting if we embody it I don't know what I'm asking but anyway goodbye again I got nothing sorry nothing is striking me right now well I have something that I can chip in because at the last Salon Zoom Salon we uh had [Music] a a meditation a guided meditation of 50 minutes about uh the ego tunnle how uh your senses build up the EGO tangle and uh how to look at yourself from the outside so transcending it and that was quite fascinating because we we uh just to give you a a short idea of it you are sitting there and you imagine and you have a candle there and uh a mirror and then you see yourself sitting here in this room uh with the candle and you sort of touch your conscious your brain uh lovingly not and that's that was something quite new to me that you can love your Consciousness so and then you move out and it's like you're looking down at a doll's house and you see yourself sitting there and touching your head lovingly and you do the same on the from where you are looking down um and it was amazing because about half of the people dropped out from this meditation they just it was just they sort of drifted away or they had to confess they just lost the thread and and I didn't because I as a child I played a lot with dolls houses and of course when you move around your dolls and you have them there and they are part of yourself why you are moving them so I had no difficulty with regard to that but the eagle tunnel is sort of sort of a bowl or sort of a egy face ah don't anyway for your container container yeah thank you a container for your spirit your spiritual Transcendence you need your body and you need uh and but it's on the other hand it is all given to you because you breathe all by yourself you breathe at night you are not aware of it so it is given to you uh and you only the only what you have to do is to become aware of it it's my my most recent uh because I'm trying to I'm wrestling with the fourth dimension and I'm getting I just can't get it how the fourth dimension Works in in the third dimension but being aware that you don't have to do anything that everything is taken care of and you just have to let go your own will and your mind uh this is something that would change a lot of things things in real life in my opinion because you don't have to fight for energy anymore you don't have to fight for territory for land you don't have you it's all given to you and you just have to enjoy it and yeah I don't know if I made myself clear I hope I did oh hi get out it's nice yeah I have the impression we are all talking a little bit in in in in Heroes or something you know a little bit today what I'm still missing is Spirit In Action because Wilber definitely mentions Spirit In Action and I guess Spirit In Action is us this is our our guilty Our obligation to be Spirit In Action can you follow me or am I completely what what is what is Wilbur's own definition of spirit and action what does he say it is well everything is Spirit In Action actually exactly so hello to you have to open up to the possibility yeah of spirit spirit I think the critical thing is to rec recognize I mean talk about mindfulness to recognize that there is a spirit because I think there's a lot of spirit Denial in our culture um when when they killed God they also somehow managed culturally you know with with our whole and now with AI it's more it's more critical than ever to make a distinction between spirit and matter and what how you know because otherwise things you know it's like to me AI is even more dangerous potentially um than the atomic bomb I mean in the sense that it can be used for good or for evil and but it's it's very powerful and it's increasing all the time um and and I just thought when you were talking mon I thought of what my therapist said last week when I met her because we were talking about the mind telling you know like you tell your mind this or that or you say I'm not going to perseverate on this particular idea or this particular situation and all this stuff about you know mindfulness and I said yeah but the way you're talking I said you're talking as if there's two minds like what what is the mind when the Mind Is Telling the mind what how does that work and then and then she said something that that I've been carrying around um I'll tell you what she says next time I see her because I've been carrying it around for a week I don't she said she said well Victoria she said remember the mind she said why should the Mind get precedence over the other organs of the body she said if you have trouble with your heart you're going to do something about you have trouble with your digestion you're going to do something about you think oh yes I have a stomach ache so I need to do blah blah blah she said she said you need to think of the Mind the same way as any other organ I mean she spoke of it it was very weird we had a very weird conversation um and and then I thought of Buddhism where they have the sense doors as they call them and it's the five senses that we have in the west and then they but they have six sense doors and The Sixth Sense door is the mind which means according to Buddhism the mind is right in that same lineup it's neither higher nor lower nor in a different category it's in the same lineup as hearing and seeing and you know tasting touching blah blah blah um because what my my therapist is not Bo and she wasn't can I interrupt you a little bit come finally get and include her only a few minutes left and I would like to hear your voice and what do you get out of the mess we are talking today actually I'm sorry I was late I didn't realize that they took too much time uh I'm overtime so I was like yeah ah I I just got the what Mona was sharing about and I I really want to I was intrigued I I really I tell you I was very intrigued about that meditation and is that available somewhere uh well uh I guess it's written down yeah somebody has it uh uh fter has it written down he created it because he was because for him medinger is one of the followers of wilver he may continue but we are also having now uh the mind uh mind side se he also that will be one of the next ones we are delving into uh so it's always about the brain but it's also about the mind and it's also about Consciousness and and when you said where we delve into uh is that a specific group your yeah that's integral Salon inte Salon VI Zoom Salone you can join I can oh this is online or yeah it's online Okay okay so uh no problem but I can ask him if he can't shares it or whatever yeah but it's a Well he he warned us before said it's rather strenuous uh and he did it himself for one week every day so uh I wonder if he has become schizophrenic or just very very calm yeah yeah um so uh let's just what Gat is for you spirit in action I I think it's it's it's everything that even if we are not doing anything so we are doing nothing and and it's it could be conscious it could be unconscious or not unconscious but like subconscious so I I I think there is no not spirit in anything so it's like either there is an act I mean a physical something coming out of it or yeah so the moves of in in um in Ascension um is ension the meditation I learned many many years ago um they say watch your mind move that was there was a resonance with that so it's like yeah you think think an attitude you think a little sentence and then you let it go and watch your mind move and and I never thought how do I do this and said just do it you know just let it happen yeah and I have to tell you um ladies I cannot be there next week because I'm in Amsterdam next next time I I will travel to Wales to a storytelling and fools workshop with Angela boo I don't know if you know her um and and then I go to Amsterdam and it's Monday I'm traveling back so I will not be here okay I want to come to a close because we have done an hour and I I wonder what you it's for you it's a short time that you have participated but if everybody can say what they what was this session today what is sort of a summary or what what can you find out I can start for me it was very uh how can I say undisciplined we are always undisciplined we start from one thing and go to the other you know but today we were sort of doing all this in my opinion so I I try to to to to understand what we did maybe you have an idea maybe I I uh get some more ideas too well that's also that's also Spirit In Action because um confused Spirit at the moment to me it's uh the way we are connecting this is what matters to me in the field and uh once you get inspired by somebody then you take it up and and you weave this threat uh and I don't think it's too too much confusion because there are threats and they form a new kind of picture for me at least as as uh Christine said it's the connection and of course the lower left the V the wi is how we connect to each other and and I do think we are rather relaxed with each other we don't have to put up a facade or anything and that's why it gets very undisciplined because if you have a facade you you have everything boxed and but it's that's not the way it is uh I think Spirit In Action is or I I feel Spirit In [Music] Action yeah it's not disciplined definitely not okay that that's my resume for today good I don't need to say anything because I totally agree with monia yeah and for me it's it in a way it comes together it's it's not separate it it might be confusing but it's it's the mind that makes confusing but it's it's it is coming together and reminds me of our experience yesterday at the workshop as well there was so much energy going on and people could experience that creative energy as very uh very overwhelming because it's it's so potent it's so intense but if you stand back from it then it all comes together in in some way yeah yeah thought you have an idea good for me it was I try I tried to create order a little bit you know and so and I felt that I don't succeed and this energy what you are saying it's yeah because I felt that many of us didn't even finish their sentence that came the next one and then the next one and then the next one like like the the spirit is rushing through us from energy is rushing from one to the other so yeah maybe it's the quality of time we're talking about the quality of Honor that was in a German group uh because you know that the 21st of April was some specific moment between the conjunction of Jupiter and um what was it Uranus and they say the astrologist say that that's a a beginning of a a new energy movement so maybe it's that what we are experiencing okay and it's creative and quick so it might be exactly it's about and it's also about letting go of the last 11 years so the death that we spoke in the beginning about so it all fits together wonderful radies thank you we meet in two weeks and get out in four weeks good bye bye bye bye